First casualty of 2012

[Steve Johnson]

Man, I'm so disappointed...

At the beginning of May, I purchased an Echinocereus rigidissimus var. rubispinus to replace one that didn't make it through the winter. Came with a bud which went into full flower on June 9. Then two weeks ago I was watering the cacti -- something about the "pink lace" just didn't seem right as it was leaning over a bit. I've been using the "pull" test for years, so I know what feels solid and what feels shaky. The "pink lace" did feel shaky, but I figured maybe the roots weren't as fully established as I thought. After our little rainstorm on Friday, I examined everything in my collection, and that plant was definitely looking strange. But did I think to check if it felt firm or mushy? No! Well, I finally took care of that this afternoon -- rotted from the inside top to bottom:

Echinocereus_rigidissimus_var_rubispinus_rot_07152012_01.JPG (120.95 KiB) Viewed 1301 times

I wanted to see what all that disgusting, gooey crap looked like, so I opened up the skin with an X-Acto knife. Here's the post-mortem:

Echinocereus_rigidissimus_var_rubispinus_rot_07152012_02.JPG (211.13 KiB) Viewed 1301 times

Now, here's a little wrinkle to this situation. The "pink lace" I got last year had already flowered, but it did come with a fruit that I harvested for seed. (Donated to my local c&s nursery since I'm not set up to grow cacti from seed.) After my new "pink lace" flowered in June, it appeared that I would get another fruit, but the spent flower fell off when I brushed (and I mean brushed) against it. Is that normal, or could it be a sign that the plant was already starting to get sick?

I'm trying to figure out what could've happened, so here are a few thoughts and questions:

1. I potted the "pink lace" with fresh, dry pumice/DG mix. If a pathogen got into the plant's roots, there was plenty of opportunity with the soil that remained in the root ball when I unpotted it from the nursery's plastic pot. In hindsight, I can see the common sense of washing the roots in warm, soapy water, although I do wonder if that would be enough to get rid of any problems beyond root mealies. (Wasn't an issue this time.)

2. I keep diligent track of my day and night temps, so watering every 2 weeks in May and June should've been fine. (I'm a little more careful with the Turbs.) However, I'm not familiar with this Echinocereus species, so is it possible that I was over-watering? I'll try again with another "pink lace", and please let me know if they should get more infrequent watering as our springs tend to be on the cool side. Remember that my area is semi-coastal -- we're not exactly desert-like compared to most of the SoCal region.

3. I'm kinda disgusted with some of the stuff I've seen from my local c&s nursery. In fact I'm inclined to go only bare-root with new plants. My cacti from Darryl are a great example -- the roots are clean, and I can see exactly what I get below-ground before I pot.

4. I threw out the pumice/DG mix and top dressing -- no point in taking a chance on recycling pathogens for another plant.

5. I can still use the pot, but it should most definitely be sterilized first. Nuke it in the microwave on high -- how many minutes should be sufficient?

By the way, right after I saw the pink lace go rotten, I gave the rest of my cacti the "pull" test. Everything but the Turbs got watered last weekend. And everything is solid. I'll have to shake off my paranoia about the light rain that came through Thursday afternoon and Friday morning. At least I don't have to water this weekend!

Thanks for any feedback you'd care to offer.

[hoteidoc]

Pretty plant to lose, Steve. Oh well - "3rd time's the charm?"

[tumamoc]

Been there, done that. I have a hard time keeping that type of Echinocereus alive more than 3-4 years in my possession .

[Saxicola]

Too bad. I've haven't had the issues with water that other people report and I've left it out in the elements for the 3 years I've owned it, including one year in Monterey right on the coast where the high rarely reached 70 degrees even this time of year. I wonder if maybe it doesn't like alternating between going totally dry then watered on a regular basis (I feel that no, or almost no, plant genuinely wants to dry out completely during the growing season). Do you know if the media was drying out completely, or was it still a little moist? That's just a guess.

Another thought is maybe it wants more sun than you give it. I know you use a shade cloth. Given all your troubles it couldn't hurt to try full sun on the next one.

Mine has done well in a peat-pumice mix (as you can see in my avatar!), but just yesterday I repotted it (the 4" pot was just too small). I've waited so long because I don't want to jinx myself, but it is just time to go up to a 6" (I really should have done it last year). I've decided to follow the lead of an expert grower (who runs a small succulent nursery) in my area that uses pure pumice for everything in pots. We'll see how that goes. In regards to the roots, did you wash off all the old media before putting it in your pumice and DG mix? Having two very dissimilar mixes in the same pot (i.e. the pumice/DG surrounding a peat based mix at the core) can cause a lot of problems.

You mention your C&S nursery, which I assume is the one you always mention here. I stopped by that place finally after the CSAA show and sale a couple weeks ago. To be honest I was disappointed. A lot of the plants looked really rough, very few plants had labels, and the prices seemed really high. Have you been to any show and sales this year? You'll see a much greater diversity of plants and (usually) cheaper prices. I'm not saying don't go there since you obviously have a good relationship with them, just that you can interact with a lot of different growers all in one place at a show. Seeing how other nurseries grow their plants may give you ideas you wouldn't get from just a single nursery alone. The Intercity show is next month at the LA Arboretum, you should go!

[Steve Johnson]

Too bad. I've haven't had the issues with water that other people report and I've left it out in the elements for the 3 years I've owned it, including one year in Monterey right on the coast where the high rarely reached 70 degrees even this time of year. I wonder if maybe it doesn't like alternating between going totally dry then watered on a regular basis (I feel that no, or almost no, plant genuinely wants to dry out completely during the growing season). Do you know if the media was drying out completely, or was it still a little moist? That's just a guess.

Another thought is maybe it wants more sun than you give it. I know you use a shade cloth. Given all your troubles it couldn't hurt to try full sun on the next one.

Mine has done well in a peat-pumice mix (as you can see in my avatar!), but just yesterday I repotted it (the 4" pot was just too small). I've waited so long because I don't want to jinx myself, but it is just time to go up to a 6" (I really should have done it last year). I've decided to follow the lead of an expert grower (who runs a small succulent nursery) in my area that uses pure pumice for everything in pots. We'll see how that goes. In regards to the roots, did you wash off all the old media before putting it in your pumice and DG mix? Having two very dissimilar mixes in the same pot (i.e. the pumice/DG surrounding a peat based mix at the core) can cause a lot of problems.

You mention your C&S nursery, which I assume is the one you always mention here. I stopped by that place finally after the CSAA show and sale a couple weeks ago. To be honest I was disappointed. A lot of the plants looked really rough, very few plants had labels, and the prices seemed really high. Have you been to any show and sales this year? You'll see a much greater diversity of plants and (usually) cheaper prices. I'm not saying don't go there since you obviously have a good relationship with them, just that you can interact with a lot of different growers all in one place at a show. Seeing how other nurseries grow their plants may give you ideas you wouldn't get from just a single nursery alone. The Intercity show is next month at the LA Arboretum, you should go!

Thanks for trying to help here. Yeah, you know the place, and both of my "pink lace" cacti came from there. I put the first one into the nursery's cactus mix when I got it last July. Seemed to do okay, but their mix ended up setting like hardpan after 3+ months of regular watering. When I unpotted my cacti for repotting in pumice/DG, their roots were barely there -- the "pink lace" included. (That mix could've used a lot more pumice.) When I got my new one, yes the soil in the nursery's pot was still clinging to the roots. I don't know if it was peat-based, but certainly dissimilar to my pumice/DG mix.

I haven't had problems transitioning any of my other cacti from the old mix to pumice/DG, but I wouldn't rule out the possibility of what you're suggesting as the problem for this plant. It's also possible that a pathogen (usually bacteria) came in the nursery's potting soil when I got the new "pink lace", and it would be the perfect situation for setting up rot. If I had washed the roots first, maybe this wouldn't have happened. Who knows? But what I can tell you is that barring some sort of injury to the plant, cacti simply don't rot due to lack of water.

I'm willing to try another "pink lace", but I maintain that I should go strictly bare-root with new cacti from here on out. Darryl keeps the species in his inventory, so my next one will be coming from CoronaCactus. In the meantime, there must be a reason why people seem to find it more difficult compared to other Echinocereus species. I'd welcome any different perspectives on this.

[majcka]

Oh. That's not good. Sorry for that.

[luddhus]

but the spent flower fell off when I brushed (and I mean brushed) against it. Is that normal, or could it be a sign that the plant was already starting to get sick?

Probably normal, Echinocereus flowers fall off very easily when they have dried up after flowering (unless they develop a fruit).

[CactusFanDan]

Sorry for your loss. I've been in a similar position to you with this species, though, as it seems that other people have been as well. This type of Echinocereus seems to be much harder to keep than any other Echinocereus species. I think it has something to do with the fact that they don't regenerate roots very easily for some reason. Or they don't seem to anyway. It's a real shame, because they make really nice plants if you can get them to grow properly. I'd like to hear what approach people that can grow them successfully use. I've had far more problems with this plant than with any Ariocarpus, Turbinicarpus or any other supposedly rot-prone species, but maybe that's because i'm less careful with it.

[tudedude]

that's some nasty looking rot. I'd throw away that pot!

This type of Echinocereus seems to be much harder to keep than any other Echinocereus species. I think it has something to do with the fact that they don't regenerate roots very easily for some reason.

If that is the case then it was probably caused by the re-pot. Maybe next time try dusting the roots with antifungal rooting hormone before re-potting. Lately my repotting method has involved spraying damaged roots with a Physan 20 solution. I've even added physan 20 to the first waterings 2 weeks after a repot. Not sure if it helps prevent root rot, but it sure helps my OCD.