What's up with Copiapoa Haseltoniana?

[BennieAnTheJets]

So I am just curious: have seen these sell for 250 dollars for a small-ish plant and there is even one for 2,500.- online now that is larger.

Why are these worth so much?

They look like a fairly regular cactus to me. Pretty, but I don't see the extreme value.

Please educate me.

[Steve Johnson]

So I am just curious: have seen these sell for 250 dollars for a small-ish plant and there is even one for 2,500.- online now that is larger.

Where did you see them at those prices?

[BennieAnTheJets]

ebay

[Steve Johnson]

ebay

Yeah, that's what I thought. eBay -- where sellers meet buyers with more money than good sense. With that said, I've purchased great cacti at reasonable prices on eBay, so it's a matter of knowing who you can trust and who you can't. Caveat Emptor.

[DaveW]

Depends as well whether they are cultivated or large illegally collected habitat plants?

However, as Steve says, you can sell anything on EBAY for ridiculous prices as long as you put "Rare" in the description. Also one country's rare plant may be more easily available in another due to CITES restrictions on international trade. There also seems to be no logic as to what plant a certain size will sell for one month and another similar the next on EBAY.

With EBAY also take into account the packing and shipping charges which often exceed the value of the item itself. Add both together first since sometimes a seemingly dearer item with free postage is actually cheaper than a seemingly cheaper one with postage extra.

An EBAY sample:-

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/153749488827

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Copiapoa-Has ... 3196670831

Also what you are actually buying since in this link they first show a big plant, but state a seedling and then show small ones. Copiapoa gigantea is considered a synonym for C. hazeltoniana:-

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Copiapoa-Gig ... 100623.m-1

There is also a situation known as "Auction Fever" where two or more people are bidding for a plant and are determined not to be beaten therefore pay over the odds for it. Always decide in advance how much it is worth and then stop bidding when it reaches that limit and wait for another coming along, or do without. Also if you want a certain plant try all the dealers lists first to find it. I know of some UK dealers who sell the same plant dearer on EBAY than if you buy from their plant lists, or from them at sales events.

[wilsontucker]

I bought one yesterday at a greenhouse that's about baseball sized for $20. They had quite a few smaller ones for $10-15. I live in the midwest, so not crazy cactus land either.

[Shane]

They're old specimens of a slow growing plant. Not sure why this slow growing plant in particular is so popular though. Also on Ebay always check the sold listings to see what something's really worth. None have actually sold for over $250. Which is still a lot but maybe reasonable for a large specimen of a slow growing plant a lot of people want

But as to why people want it so much, who knows? It's the same with the Galapagos cacti. They're not really special plants just just hard to find and so apparently desirable

[Shane]

I think also the supply of individual, scarce or slow growing cacti is pretty inelastic (number of plants for sale doesn't change in the short term in response to price). Which makes plants like this vulnerable to price spikes in response to an uptick in demand. And the percieved value of a cactus can increase with price, increasing the price further as people perceive its value to be higher. Or as Steve says, buyers who have more money than sense. This is also what leads to bubbles in things like the housing market

I bought into something like this a few months ago. I bought a variegated Schlumbergera cutting for $22 (see this topic viewtopic.php?f=31&t=43869). It was only worth that much because people (including me) perceived it as valuable. I like to think I would still have bought it if it was $5 but I'm not sure (I did like it, to be fair, but if it was cheap I might not have had any urgency and just forgotten about it). The really interesting thing is that variegated Schlumbergera has been valuable for years (see old forum posts) and the supply hasn't increased enough to bring the value down

[DaveW]

The reason why Galapagos cacti are dear Shane is Ecuador does not allow any out, be they propagations or seed except to scientific organisation and then infrequently. Therefore only those that "escaped" long ago in the past before these restriction were enforced will be propagated from and few of their owners do so. I gather you cannot go to the Galapagos direct, you have to go from Ecuador and their Customs search for plants and seeds of all who do on their return.

The one reason people initially pay a high price for your variegated Schlumbergera cutting or similar plants is they can propagate them reasonably quickly and put them on EBAY again and not only get their money back but make a profit. Just as with expensive seed of new species.

A chap I knew bought 10 seeds of Mammillaria bertholdii when first offered for £20. Raised 4 seedlings and grafted them. He then produced offsets on these and grafted these and sold them at £10 a time, even with cost of grafting stock quickly getting his original investment back and making a profit. Of course this only works initially whilst they are rare and a novelty since eventually the market becomes flooded and prices fall. I wonder how much the first grafted "Red Lollypop" Gymnocalycium's sold for before they were mass propagated?

[BennieAnTheJets]

They're old specimens of a slow growing plant. Not sure why this slow growing plant in particular is so popular though. Also on Ebay always check the sold listings to see what something's really worth. None have actually sold for over $250. Which is still a lot but maybe reasonable for a large specimen of a slow growing plant a lot of people want

But as to why people want it so much, who knows? It's the same with the Galapagos cacti. They're not really special plants just just hard to find and so apparently desirable

All the answers are interesting and certainly an auction is an auction, with all the frills and excitement, where we humans show our folly and strange desire to fight for and possess things that others also find desirable and the artificial values we put on things around us. I guess it is ok as entertainment with a healthy dose of self-awareness and sufficient funds. I enjoy it as a really fun distraction with the occasional addition to my life that can bring longer term joy or a chance for me to laugh at my frustration when I lose an item to another bidder, maybe during the last 15 sec of the auction. Ha! It also gives the charity or seller running the auction a chance to raise funds. Not so bad.

Thanks for all the answers! Shane, I was looking for something like what you said: "large specimen of a slow growing plant" I guess that explains it somewhat. Because I see other cacti that sell on ebay for much less, so it can't just be due to the auction.