A beginner's English windowsill collection

[ElieEstephane]

some Rebutia/Aylostera hybrids (seed pods came on a albiflora x heliosa plant),

i believe that's the inverse of the rebutia "sunrise" hybrid so it should be interesting!

[Grimm]

some Rebutia/Aylostera hybrids (seed pods came on a albiflora x heliosa plant),

i believe that's the inverse of the rebutia "sunrise" hybrid so it should be interesting!

I didn't think it made a difference which way around the parents were? In any case, there's a good chance that the pollen came from a different Rebutia/Aylostera altogether so it will be a complete surprise when they flower! The seedlings are weak though, for some reason, they have grown very slowly and one grew very oddly (it just formed a smooth green ball). I took them out of the propagator a couple of weeks ago and one has shriveled up and died, I'm keeping a close eye on the rest.

[Grimm]

Some more photos, starting with Titanopsis calcarea that were sown in July 2017. They don't look too happy, but they're alive!



And the only survivor from 12 seeds of Ophthalmophyllum lydiae. I have no idea if this is ready to come out from the propogator or not Any advice is gratefully received





and Rhipsalis gaertneri that I sowed in autumn 2017. These are from pods from a newly bought cactus, pollinated in the shop or nursery, and were planted to gain experience rather than a desire for dozens of Easter Cacti



A few cacti are also in bud, with "Old Faithful" M.zeilmanniana showing the rest how to do it as usual! The following shows the most developed bud, but there's loads more.



However I've also noticed something potentially sinister at the base, hopefully this is just a monstrous growth Any suggestions are welcome!

[ElieEstephane]

Hello Grimm
It does matter which way around the hybrid is. See esp's reply on http://cactiguide.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... ns#p338615

Funny you are in England and your Zeilmanniana is already in bud. The weather is much warmer here now and none of my 4 zeilmanniana have buds yet Maybe they're warmer in the house?
As for the weird growth, it could be that it corked being hidden between the offsets or thr ground and then started growing again. Happens a lot with parodia ottonis. If you feel uncomfortable with it, cut it off

[DaveW]

F1 hybrids all have to be the same parental cross each time. You cannot use the F1 hybrid to produce the same cross (unless vegetatively propagated) since it will be a totally different entity. Using the opposite parents does not produce the same hybrid, but an entirely different one.

https://www.rhs.org.uk/advice/profile?PID=710

In many cases buying seed of supposed cactus or succulent hybrids is a chancy business since few seeds-men would go to the trouble required in the link above which large seed firms selling F1 hybrids of more commercial or agricultural plants have to. At best you are more likely to get F2 seed passed off as the same F1 hybrid as it's parents, which it will not be. It may be an even better, or an even worse hybrid than it's parents, but certainly not the same. That is why buying seed of something like the unusual Japanese Astrophytum's is a lottery, since again you may get something better or something worse than the seed parents. The only way to be sure of the same hybrid is vegetative propagation, which is why grafting is so often used with those plants to propagate them quickly commercially.

[Grimm]

Funny you are in England and your Zeilmanniana is already in bud. The weather is much warmer here now and none of my 4 zeilmanniana have buds yet Maybe they're warmer in the house?
As for the weird growth, it could be that it corked being hidden between the offsets or thr ground and then started growing again. Happens a lot with parodia ottonis. If you feel uncomfortable with it, cut it off

Yes, I have to keep my house warm with most rooms at 18C, so my cacti are more reactive to day lengths than outside temperature. It does mean, however, that I will probably never see some of my cacti flower, as they don't get a true winter

The growth seems to be fluffy rather than corky. I would cut it out and try to grow it, but it's tucked well under other offsets so I would have to de-pot the whole plant to get it out, and it was only repotted last year.

[Spikylover]

F1 hybrids all have to be the same parental cross each time. You cannot use the F1 hybrid to produce the same cross (unless vegetatively propagated) since it will be a totally different entity. Using the opposite parents does not produce the same hybrid, but an entirely different one.

https://www.rhs.org.uk/advice/profile?PID=710

In many cases buying seed of supposed cactus or succulent hybrids is a chancy business since few seeds-men would go to the trouble required in the link above which large seed firms selling F1 hybrids of more commercial or agricultural plants have to. At best you are more likely to get F2 seed passed off as the same F1 hybrid as it's parents, which it will not be. It may be an even better, or an even worse hybrid than it's parents, but certainly not the same. That is why buying seed of something like the unusual Japanese Astrophytum's is a lottery, since again you may get something better or something worse than the seed parents. The only way to be sure of the same hybrid is vegetative propagation, which is why grafting is so often used with those plants to propagate them quickly commercially.

So it's basically pointless to buy Echinocereus X
lloydii or X Roetteri seeds as the plants could have crossed together or crossed again with their orginal parents?
What i understand from your reply is that if i want the mentionned hybrids, i'm gonna have to cross the parents myself. Is that right?
Sorry grimm to hijack your thread

[DaveW]

I suppose as my previous link says it is how stable the hybrid has become in nature, rather than a cross made in recent cultivation. It is said that some of the species or genera we grow as true species and genera once arose as hybrids in the dim distant past, and even intergeneric crosses that have become stabilised and now recognised as genera. Examples are Echinocactus grusonii which DNA seems to indicate may have originally been a cross between an Echinocactus and a Ferocactus and Astrophytum ornatum which grows far faster than the other Astropyytum's may have been a cross between an Astrophytum and either a Ferocactus or Echinocactus, which over hundreds of years has become stabilised and so breeds true from seed.

[Grimm]

So it's basically pointless to buy Echinocereus X
lloydii or X Roetteri seeds as the plants could have crossed together or crossed again with their orginal parents?
What i understand from your reply is that if i want the mentionned hybrids, i'm gonna have to cross the parents myself. Is that right?
Sorry grimm to hijack your thread

That's alright

If they are a decent seller they will either be diligent in making sure the right parents are crossed, or they will warn you of variation, as with Southfield Nursery's hybrid "Razzle Dazzle" which are sold as plants and seed packs where they not only state "variable flower colours" but also give a photo to illustrate:


http://cactusland.co.uk/shop.php?variety=1181

I knew that every new hybridisation is a bit of a lottery, even if you ensure that the correct parents are used, but I didn't think albiflora x heliosa hybrids would give a notably different range of result to heliosa x albiflora

[Spikylover]

So it's basically pointless to buy Echinocereus X
lloydii or X Roetteri seeds as the plants could have crossed together or crossed again with their orginal parents?
What i understand from your reply is that if i want the mentionned hybrids, i'm gonna have to cross the parents myself. Is that right?
Sorry grimm to hijack your thread

That's alright

If they are a decent seller they will either be diligent in making sure the right parents are crossed, or they will warn you of variation, as with Southfield Nursery's hybrid "Razzle Dazzle" which are sold as plants and seed packs where they not only state "variable flower colours" but also give a photo to illustrate:


http://cactusland.co.uk/shop.php?variety=1181

I knew that every new hybridisation is a bit of a lottery, even if you ensure that the correct parents are used, but I didn't think albiflora x heliosa hybrids would give a notably different range of result to heliosa x albiflora

These are pretty cool! Seed packets you say i just might get some of those! Thanks for the pointers.
Very lovely collection by the way!

[ElieEstephane]

Hey grimm i think that monstrose mammillaria growth is contagious! I was checking up on some of the plants and my mammillaria magnimamma has one too. It's hard and looks very hairy with transparent spines (which is not the "color" of the new spines). It wasn't there at the start of the week
Oh and one of the zeilmannias has buds

[ElieEstephane]

So it's basically pointless to buy Echinocereus X
lloydii or X Roetteri seeds as the plants could have crossed together or crossed again with their orginal parents?
What i understand from your reply is that if i want the mentionned hybrids, i'm gonna have to cross the parents myself. Is that right?
Sorry grimm to hijack your thread

I think it's futile to buy labelled xlloydii and xroetteri seeds as grimm says. Mesa gardens labelled their seeds of both species with flower colors. Most probably seeds will not come true to their parents.
Xlloydii and xroetterii are not species on their own in its sense. They are the result of pollination between E. Dasyacanthus and coccineus (and vice versa). So to be clear, an xroetterii (or xlloydii) pollinated by another xroetterii (or xlloydii) doesn't yield reliable seeds. You either get new hybrids or a reversion to the parents.
My opinion is to look up localities where both parents are present together closely and where these hybrids are present and buy E dasyacanthus seeds for xlloydii or coccineus for xroetterii. These seeds will probably be hybrids. Or you can ask the seed firm if they crossed the parents themselves
Sorry again grimm to clutter your thread

[Grimm]

Hey grimm i think that monstrose mammillaria growth is contagious! I was checking up on some of the plants and my mammillaria magnimamma has one too. It's hard and looks very hairy with transparent spines (which is not the "color" of the new spines). It wasn't there at the start of the week
Oh and one of the zeilmannias has buds

We're going to have to be careful if we're starting to spread cacti disease through the internet

Are we having a zeilmannia race

[ElieEstephane]

Are we having a zeilmannia race

Oh it's on! I think my warmer weather will help

[Grimm]

Second to flower is also a Rebutia, R.albiflora this time. These four misshapen plants are all that is left of a small clump that tried its very best to die on me last year. The roots and main head died, and everything seemed to be covered in tiny mealy bugs. I ended up soaking what was left with systemic pesticide, which may be the cause of some of the abnormal growth. I'm very surprised they flowered, to say the least!



This species has a special place in my heart, as my Dad had a large mound which was my favorite of his cacti when I was growing up. His has also been struggling in recent years, dying back a little, then recovering, then dying back again. I'm hoping that I can get mine to settle down and grow happily.