Why aren’t epiphytic cacti more popular?

[Mrs.Green]

Reading a lot on different fora and sites, it seems to me that epiphytic cacti aren’t that popular as compared to desert cacti? I may be wrong, maybe the epiphytic cacti people keep to themselves on epi fora and don’t mix as much with the ‘other’ cacti people?

If my assumption is correct ( epi cacti are less popular) , why ?

[anttisepp]

Forest cacti are usually big or huge.
Desert cacti very often small and compact.
If I could live somewhere in Queensland on own farm I'd collect whole botanic garden...

[Mrs.Green]

Forest cacti are usually big or huge.
Desert cacti very often small and compact.
If I could live somewhere in Queensland on own farm I'd collect whole botanic garden...

Oh..me too! Seeing all these blogs with hundreds of blooming cacti I sometimes wonder why I even bother keeping cacti.. Apart from the Schlumbergeras who seems to find the freezing cold indoor temperature ( well..according to most people) we prefer. On the other hand..I am not sure I would be very happy in Queenslands temperatures.. Anything above 15 celsius outside is to hot in my mind..

[DaveW]

Generally the epiphytes need warmer temperatures in winter and more humidity than terrestrial cacti so don't mix too well in the same greenhouse being more Orchid culture. Also an unshaded greenhouse whilst probably suiting the terrestrial cacti may prove a bit too warm for them in summer. In the UK many recommend putting epiphytic cacti outside in summer and not leaving them in the heat of the greenhouse, only bringing them in for winter.

I grow a few epiphytic cacti but they do not do as well in my greenhouse as terrestrial cacti do and have to come indoors for winter.

Disocactus (Nopalxochia) phyllanthoides.

nopalxochia2.jpg (50.74 KiB) Viewed 2404 times

The same can apply to some terrestrial cacti less used to really hot greenhouse conditions that may do better outside in summer. For instance Austrocactus and Pterocactus that come from Southern Patagonia's cooler windy conditions.

[greenknight]

I wouldn't say they're unpopular, but that they're not as much specialist plants. Some of the smaller types, certain Rhipsalis and Hatiora species, are common easy-care houseplants. Schlumbergeras are produced by the millions for holiday bloom, and likewise easy to grow - though getting them to bloom in centrally-heated homes takes some doing. Aside from the "How do I get my Christmas Cactus to bloom?" articles, there's not that much to say about them.

Then there are the larger types, like the "Epiphyllum Hybrids" - it takes a lot of space to build a collection of those, thus they're not a common specialty. Also not much of a challenge to grow, aside from finding room for them.

[Mrs.Green]

Generally the epiphytes need warmer temperatures in winter and more humidity than terrestrial cacti so don't mix too well in the same greenhouse being more Orchid culture. Also an unshaded greenhouse whilst probably suiting the terrestrial cacti may prove a bit too warm for them in summer. In the UK many recommend putting epiphytic cacti outside in summer and not leaving them in the heat of the greenhouse, only bringing them in for winter.

I grow a few epiphytic cacti but they do not do as well in my greenhouse as terrestrial cacti do and have to come indoors for winter.

Disocactus (Nopalxochia) phyllanthoides.


nopalxochia2.jpg

The same can apply to some terrestrial cacti less used to really hot greenhouse conditions that may do better outside in summer. For instance Austrocactus and Pterocactus that come from Southern Patagonia's cooler windy conditions.

Thank you DaveW. Of course, so silly of me..I tend to forget that most people here, probably don’t keep their cacti indoors.. With that in mind the answer is pretty obvious.

Lovely pic! What are the brown spots on the stems? Fungi, virus or something else?

I wouldn't say they're unpopular, but that they're not as much specialist plants. Some of the smaller types, certain Rhipsalis and Hatiora species, are common easy-care houseplants. Schlumbergeras are produced by the millions for holiday bloom, and likewise easy to grow - though getting them to bloom in centrally-heated homes takes some doing. Aside from the "How do I get my Christmas Cactus to bloom?" articles, there's not that much to say about them.

Then there are the larger types, like the "Epiphyllum Hybrids" - it takes a lot of space to build a collection of those, thus they're not a common specialty. Also not much of a challenge to grow, aside from finding room for them.

Thank you Greenknight. So one could be led to belive that some people find them to ‘easy’ , common and not challenging enough?

[DaveW]

Whether the spots are a virus or not I don't know. They have been remarked on many times for this species in cultivation. Some think they are a virus, but I have seen no tests that confirm that. Some think they are cold spots and my conditions are cold. However I would have expected them to be larger if caused by cold. Whatever they are they don't seem to affect the plant or its flowering. Does anybody have a plant of it that does not spot?

Also See:-

https://forum.bcss.org.uk/viewtopic.php?t=155710

https://forum.bcss.org.uk/viewtopic.php?t=165891

[esp_imaging]

Given that they are a fairly small subset of all cacti, they don't seem that unpopular.
And given that most of them aren't especially small, they don't lend themselves to people with limited space keeping many of them, unlike, say Mammillarias or Turbinicarpus. I'd love space for Selenicerei and walls of cascading mature Rhipsalis but don't have it.
I have several epiphytes on my less-sunny windowsills and enjoy their different forms and flowering patterns. One Christmas cactus has only just started flowering. A Hatiora salicorniodes will be in flower soon, at times when I expect all my "desert" cacti to still be resting. Hatiora rosea will put on a fine display too later in the spring, both with many flowers from 10cm or smaller pots.

[Mrs.Green]

Whether the spots are a virus or not I don't know. They have been remarked on many times for this species in cultivation. Some think they are a virus, but I have seen no tests that confirm that. Some think they are cold spots and my conditions are cold. However I would have expected them to be larger if caused by cold. Whatever they are they don't seem to affect the plant or its flowering. Does anybody have a plant of it that does not spot?

Also See:-

https://forum.bcss.org.uk/viewtopic.php?t=155710

https://forum.bcss.org.uk/viewtopic.php?t=165891

Thank you DaveW! I have seen similar looking spots on Hatiora gaertneri I have had. These are the massproduced cacti bought in grocery stores and nothing ‘special’. The Schlumbergeras ( same massprodused holidaycacti) on the other hand don’t have these or have been ‘infected’ even when the plants have been close together, touching each other.

Given that they are a fairly small subset of all cacti, they don't seem that unpopular.
And given that most of them aren't especially small, they don't lend themselves to people with limited space keeping many of them, unlike, say Mammillarias or Turbinicarpus. I'd love space for Selenicerei and walls of cascading mature Rhipsalis but don't have it.
I have several epiphytes on my less-sunny windowsills and enjoy their different forms and flowering patterns. One Christmas cactus has only just started flowering. A Hatiora salicorniodes will be in flower soon, at times when I expect all my "desert" cacti to still be resting. Hatiora rosea will put on a fine display too later in the spring, both with many flowers from 10cm or smaller pots.

Good points, didn’t think about the space some of these epiphytes would require... Please post some pics when they flower! You mention your less sunny windowsills.. My now flowering Rhipsalis cassutha hangs in one of the windows who receives the most sunlight in summer. In all fairness, it becomes a little more yellowish in colour but thats all. I guess a placement like this in many other countries would mean RIP pretty soon..

[leland]

Many of the tropical epiphytes are large growing climbing or pendant plants. 30 foot houseplants are a tall order for most people. One selenicereus I started from a cutting a couple of years ago in a wall pot has climbed the 8 foot fence, run another 12 feet horizontally through the razor wire and is now climbing an electric pole! I have been growing them outdoors for several years in hanging baskets and am just now getting into the task of pruning/repotting some of them. Because I have waited so long it is like major surgery, but doing it in the dry season is not too much stress for them. Others I have started planting rooted cuttings in trees to avoid the work and expense of hanging baskets. In the end, in my climate, this will provide handsomer plants.

I have notice that on the YouTube channel Epiphytic Cacti the presenter seems to have her collection in what looks like 5 inch pots. This must involve very skilled pruning, almost a bonsai type of approach. The cramped roots will probably also cause the plants to bloom better.

As in other cacti, know your plants and their growth habit before you commit.

[Mrs.Green]

Many of the tropical epiphytes are large growing climbing or pendant plants. 30 foot houseplants are a tall order for most people. One selenicereus I started from a cutting a couple of years ago in a wall pot has climbed the 8 foot fence, run another 12 feet horizontally through the razor wire and is now climbing an electric pole! I have been growing them outdoors for several years in hanging baskets and am just now getting into the task of pruning/repotting some of them. Because I have waited so long it is like major surgery, but doing it in the dry season is not too much stress for them. Others I have started planting rooted cuttings in trees to avoid the work and expense of hanging baskets. In the end, in my climate, this will provide handsomer plants.

I have notice that on the YouTube channel Epiphytic Cacti the presenter seems to have her collection in what looks like 5 inch pots. This must involve very skilled pruning, almost a bonsai type of approach. The cramped roots will probably also cause the plants to bloom better.

As in other cacti, know your plants and their growth habit before you commit.

Thank you for your responce . That Selenicereus must be a sight! Do you have a photo of it?

I do agree about the ‘know your plants’ comment but..You live in a country were you can grow your plants outdoors all year round , which off course greatly affects their growth and size. I have a lot of houseplants, cacti are only a small percentage of them . Yes, I can grow several of these outdoors for å few months every year but none of them would survive the six months of winter every year.

So plants that quickly will grow into huge specimens in your country will probably never even get close to the size in my parts of the world. They survive the winter ( most of them) but in reallity they have only a few months to grow when they in their natural habitat have a longer growth ‘window’ .

[Download]

They're quite popular here in Australia, more so than desert cacti I suspect. You don't see much for sale in shops but i suspect that's because people had out cuttings for free all the time.

Desert cacti are more common in hardware and garden stores, but I suspect it's collectors buying those up, not average gardeners. Hardware stores where I live had trouble stocking desert cacti over COVID so they got lots of grafted gymnos which have basically not sold. They're the sort of thing average Joe buys, but once people interested already had one they couldn't sell the rest.

[DaveW]

Probably its the hybridist gardeners versus purists like me regarding so called hybrid Epiphyllum's or still better called Orchid Cacti. The hybrids tend to be grown more by the gardener types rather than the botanically inclined who prefer true species. The so called hybrid Epiphyllum's are more akin to growing hybrid begonias or roses.

It is much harder to get hold of true Epiphyllum species and many of the true smaller epiphytic species. It seems to be human nature that species were never good enough for certain growers throughout history who must always try and "guild the Lilly" to "improve" them by creating a hybrid with much larger and different coloured flowers. So there seems to be a divide between the two groups. Those who prefer what have now become simply garden plants, or those preferring botanical species, each to his own it seems. In some cases such as Rhipsalis many are not all that spectacular out of flower for the space they tale up.

Epiphyllum hybrids is a misleading name for them but has become traditional, since few have any genuine Epiphyllum blood in their veins and were initially Disocactus crossed with Heliocereus. Apart from a couple of larger flowered species some of the true Epiphyllums have long tubed smaller white flowers which are nothing as spectacular as the large flowered hybrids the gardeners love.

https://cactiguide.com/cactus/?genus=Epiphyllum

The botanist David Hunt used to maintain the easy way to tell a hybrid Epiphyllum was if it had or developed multi-angled stems since all true species he claimed had only flat leaflike stems with a slim circular base. The multiangled stems they get from the Heliocereus cross.

http://cactiguide.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7689

https://www.bing.com/images/search?view ... ajaxhist=0

Regarding sales in retail outlets, these tend to price on size and not rarity, therefore I guess usually being bigger the rapid growing Orchid Cacti would be priced higher than small terrestrial cacti, even though they gained size quicker and were easier to propagate from cuttings?

[esp_imaging]

In some cases such as Rhipsalis many are not all that spectacular out of flower for the space they tale up.

Or to put this another way, some of them are only spectacular if allowed a huge amount of space. I have Rhipsalis paradoxa sprawling as one or 2 stems along windowsill in my bathroom looking very untidy, and completely unspectacular even though it is flowering. Maybe I should get rid

The botanist David Hunt used to maintain the easy way to tell a hybrid Epiphyllum was if it had or developed multi-angled stems since all true species he claimed had only flat leaflike stems with a slim circular base. The multiangled stems they get from the Heliocereus cross.

I've no idea about this, as I don't have any plants claiming to be Epiphyllum species, but I was confused a few years ago when I took Hatiora rosea cuttings. All the new growth was multi-angled,. They seem to do a few multi-angled segments at first (presumably these are stiffer?) to grow up and out, then revert to more normal flat segments which presumably give more area for photosynthesis and lend themselves to forming pendulous chains.

[Aiko]

If my assumption is correct ( epi cacti are less popular) , why ?

We should be able to see if that is true next wednesday, when the talk by Frank Supplie on Epiphyllum will take place. If the number of attendees is well below 400, you might say this is true.