clumping multihead Melocactus?

[Hero878]

Picked up these two cactus yesterday and can't tell if one of Magnificus or warasii. The other is a Leninghausii off course

https://ibb.co/Pjf5ThG
https://ibb.co/tbsy5B1

[anttisepp]

Magnificus imho. Plant them separately, big plants need much individual space. Both species give basal sprouts.

[Hero878]

Magnificus imho. Plant them separately, big plants need much individual space. Both species give basal sprouts.

Thanks
I was hoping they would be Magnificus. Seems warasii is rarer around here.
Interesting you say to plant them separately as I usually seen them in clusters. But I would like one standalone specimen. Basal spouts as in new pups from the base? I noticed some of the tiny sprouts had rotted underneath so I repotted it in a shallow bowl now to give it extra room.

[DaveW]

There is a difference between natural clumps where the plant is offsetting normally to those produced by putting several small plants in a pot as some nurserymen do. This is in order to produce artificial clumps producing saleable plants much quicker, but misleads the buyer.

This is one reason why many cactus shows used to have a rule "only one plant per pot" since some exhibitors were creating artificial clumps by planting separate plants close together and forming artificial clumps to try and fool the judges they had naturally offset. That would mean the plants were much older than they really were since if they were naturally offsetting they would have taken much longer to grow meaning better long term cultivation.

[Hero878]

There is a difference between natural clumps where the plant is offsetting normally to those produced by putting several small plants in a pot as some nurserymen do. This is in order to produce artificial clumps producing saleable plants much quicker, but misleads the buyer.

This is one reason why many cactus shows used to have a rule "only one plant per pot" since some exhibitors were creating artificial clumps by planting separate plants close together and forming artificial clumps to try and fool the judges they had naturally offset. That would mean the plants were much older than they really were since if they were naturally offsetting they would have taken much longer to grow meaning better long term cultivation.

Interesting! I think mine are definitely natural clumps because when I repotted it they did not easily come apart and were stuck together. So I didn't try to tease them apart and just put them in a bowl instead of a pot so that I could give them horizontal space.

[mikethecactusguy]

Altmans Nursery in Arizona seems to be the primary supplier to HD, Lowes and various other nurseries in my area. Depending on the pot size and the plant species you can sometime have one filled with up to 6 individual plant closely spaced together. And as DaveW says, it gives the illusion of a clumping or offsetting plant. Nice thing is that they only cost about 30% more than a single plant but you get 4 to 6 smaller individuals and 6 month later they have grown to the size of the single plant. Some may even start to clump by themselves.

[Hero878]

All repotted
https://ibb.co/vwNYdYS
https://ibb.co/z7Mj3yx
https://ibb.co/T2FpBby

They defintely look like natural clumps as I can see the offsets sprouting from below

[anttisepp]

Sorry now they look like sarasii and claviceps on beterr quality photo. False clumps.

[Hero878]

Sorry now they look like sarasii and claviceps on beterr quality photo. False clumps.

Thanks! Shame the clumps are false :/ but they done a good job at imitating real clumps I guess I'll keep Magnificus on my wish list then. I was also leaning to warasii or clavicles in the end because Magnificus has that amazing blue matte colouring to them which these don't.

[mikethecactusguy]

Hi
A couple of low quality pics that show actual clumping on one of my own.

20210221_190929.jpg (70.58 KiB) Viewed 1986 times

20210221_190939.jpg (75.89 KiB) Viewed 1986 times

[teo]

This is also a (true) clump - grown from a single small plant - but which is it (not flowered yet). I have assumed magnifica

DSC_5573-c.JPG (66.16 KiB) Viewed 1976 times

[Hero878]

Thanks for the photos of what proper clumping looks like.
Now I can see why the price was lower than I expected as I've seen ones with proper clumping on sale online for much much higher. Either way I'm happy with the purchase.

I can't tell if the Leninghausii is real clumping or false? There's defintely two real pups on the edge but not sure about the large ones?

Out of interest can you help me determine if this bowl of Magnificus is also false clumping? Seems to be growing all over the place not just from the base plus there doesn't seem to be a mother plant there so I suspect it is also false but looks really cool!
https://www.cactusmania.it/boutique/not ... s-vaso-20/

[Hero878]

This is also a (true) clump - grown from a single small plant - but which is it (not flowered yet). I have assumed magnifica
DSC_5573-c.JPG

Based on the colour being kind of blue matte I would say it is Magnificus too. A very nice specimen!

[mikethecactusguy]

I know you already repotted, but if it were me, since they are individual plants, I would try and separate the groups, pot them as individuals and then let them grow and clump naturally. Looking again at the pictures it does look like a few may have already started to clump.

[anttisepp]

Hero878, all plants on all your images are false clumps.
Real clump begin at much elder age naturally.
As a grower with relatively long experience I prefer to grow individual plants (much easier due to lack of space) and usually I take spontaneous sprouts away if it's not absolutely clumping plant, e.g. Chamaecereus silvestrii or Escobaria minima.