Anderson's "The Cactus Family" as a guide to nomen

phil_SK · Post by **phil_SK** » Sun May 04, 2008 8:47 am

peterb wrote:Cylindropuntia viridiflora, for example, gets this treatment in Anderson:

"Cyindropuntia X viridiflora is a naturally occurring hybrid, C. imbricata X C. whipplei. Distribution: New Mexico."

That's it. Notice the flat out assertion *is*.

If you don't like that, you'll hate the NCL version! At least Anderson manages a sentence. The NCL entry reads as follows:

08725 C. xviridiflora (B+R) Knuth 1936/K-ABC 124. B: 01896 Opuntia viridiflora B+R 1919/CBR 1:55. [Cylindropuntia imbricata x C. whipplei]. Distr: US (New Mexico).

This style is typical of the NCL. A proper species with a description is reported as this random example (Lasiocereus rupicola):

00929 L. rupicola Ritt 1981/KSA 4: 1478, figs 1348, 1349, 1351-1354; [1966/SuNL 45(8 ): 119, sine typ.] T: PE, Cajamarca, San Marcos, 1957, Ritter 661.
Bo tree-like, 3-4 m; trsp < 10 cm; br irregular, 4.5-7 cm Ø, broadly spreading, dark green; ri 18-21, 5-7 mm high, c. 5 mm broad; ar c. 5 mm, 4-6 mm apart, csp c. 12, mostly resembling the rsp, sometimes 1-2 stronger, 1-3 cm, darker; rsp c. 20, 5-10 mm, acicular, pale yellow; flgar near br apex, somewhat larger, orange-felted; fl subtended by a ring of bristles, tubular-funnelform, 5 x 2 cm, regular, unscented; pc+hyp c. 3 cm overall; sc numerous, black, c. 1 cm, aristate, with thick white wool and numerous long orange-brown bristles; tep c. 20 x 5 mm, linear-aristate; otep white below, black above; itep white; sti 7 mm, white; fr globose, c. 2.5 cm Ø; sd 1.2 mm, black. ............195.3-4

Compare this with Anderson's:

Lasiocereus rupicola F. Ritter 1966
Plants treelike, spreading widely, 3-4 m (9.8-13 ft) high. Stems dark green, 4.5-7 cm (1.8-2.8 in) in diameter. Ribs 18-21, 5-7 mm (0.2-0.3 in) high, to 5 mm wide, with distinct tubercles. Areoles with whitish wool. Flowering areoles large, round, with orange to golden brown wool. Central spines about 6 with 1-2 heavier, 1-3 cm (0.4-1.2 in) long. Radial spines about 20, needle-like, erect, 0.5-1 cm (0.2-0.4 in) long. Flowers to 5 cm (2 in) long. Fruits globose, to 2.5 cm (1 in) in diameter. Distribution: San Marcos, Cajamarca, Peru.

You can bet that both descriptions are based on Ritter's original description in Succulenta, hence the similarities.

lancer99 · Post by **lancer99** » Sun May 04, 2008 10:11 am

Phil,
Thx for that example -- now I see what people mean when they describe the NCL as "full of abbreviations."

Seems a bit silly...they saved what, maybe 5 or (at best) 10% space by using all those abbreviations.

I did linguistics at college, so will treat it as just another foreign language to learn

Could I ask you, or some other willing volunteer, to quote a bit from the taxonomic keys in the NCL?

Thanks!

-R

hayu · Post by **hayu** » Sun May 04, 2008 11:42 pm

If anyone still wants this book Bob Smoley has it for 99.95. If it's in stock. I was looking at his book list today and saw it. The item# is 91025

His address is bobsmoley'sgardenworld.com and his two emails are: bsmoley@pgh.net and bsmoley@bsmoley's.com. I keep getting returned mail error but he has answered all my emails.

lancer99 · Post by **lancer99** » Mon May 05, 2008 1:17 am

Hayu,
Well spotted, thanks so much! I went ahead and ordered it on-line, so I'm hoping he still has it in stock...and that it doesn't take "up to eight weeks," as mentioned on the order form, to ship it.

I will still probably pick up a copy of the NCL somewhere down the line, but for now, that made my decision easy...thx again!

-R

Peyote Pete · Post by **Peyote Pete** » Mon May 05, 2008 1:30 am

Good luck on your purchase.

lancer99 · Post by **lancer99** » Mon May 05, 2008 11:18 am

Got an e-mail from Bob Smokey's that Anderson is out of print. Back to the drawing board!

-R

Peyote Pete · Post by **Peyote Pete** » Mon May 05, 2008 2:39 pm

Doh! That sucks, may your search be fruitful.

Post by **daiv** » Mon May 05, 2008 8:22 pm

Hi all! This thread was certainly a good read. I am amazed that Anderson's book is selling for so much. I regularily abuse mine - maybe I better be nicer to it! Under "Sources" above you can see my reviews of the two books -albiet they are broad and brief.

I agree fully with what others have said -no one book will suffice. As many books as you can afford and all the on-line cross-referencing is the way to go.

This might help.

The best feature:
Anderson - The format. Just like you'd expect. Alphabetical, bold headings, space between paragraphs, index, etc. all very intuitive. The only part missing from the format are range maps and a picture for each species.

NCL - The pictures -They worked hard to get all those images and it sure is nice to see pictures of some that you can't even find on the web. Pseudorhipsalis for example. Who bothers putting pictures of those online? Nobody.

The worst feature
Anderson -Pictures Lack of, or substandard images. Sometime Anderson has pictures of dead, dried up spines that look like a cow steped on them. Not useful for ID at all.

NCL -The Format! As mentioned above, all those abbreviations do not save that much ink and paper. I'd have paid $20 more or whatever to have the descriptions in an easier to read format.

Post by **CoronaCactus** » Tue May 06, 2008 4:36 pm

For fun (cause i'm a fun kinda guy) I searched ebay for the book. I found 2 listings from the same seller...$20 + $5 ship...WHAT!?

After reading the description and looking at the photos...this guy scanned the book and has it on CD (i think it was in a PDF file) The scans are not the greatest, but the text is all readable.

Sorry no link, this was a few days ago, and now the actions aren't showing up...they must have ended. I just searched with *the cactus family*. I'm sure the seller will relist them. Wish i had written down his seller name...

lancer99 · Post by **lancer99** » Tue May 06, 2008 10:30 pm

Yeah, I saw that too. Not sure what they copyright owner would think about it

-R

Peyote Pete · Post by **Peyote Pete** » Wed May 07, 2008 12:41 am

I don't know if your into lithops or not, but they are auctioning some rare books on ebay.

Lithops - Treasure of the Veld
Lithops Flowering Stones

They are pretty pricey though.

Post by **daiv** » Wed May 07, 2008 2:12 am

CoronaCactus wrote: After reading the description and looking at the photos...this guy scanned the book and has it on CD (i think it was in a PDF file) The scans are not the greatest, but the text is all readable.

Sounds rather illegal to me. Glad it isn't my book being stolen.

Post by **CoronaCactus** » Wed May 07, 2008 2:31 am

oh boy, do i feel stupid...

I had edited my message before posting, but edited too much! I gotta pay more attention when i post at work

I wanted to also add, that i did not endorse this and you should not buy this. and actually, thats probably why it's not on ebay anymore...

Sorry that wasn't clear, cause without that, sounded like i was ok with it.

Post by **daiv** » Wed May 07, 2008 2:36 am

No worries on that Daryl -

lancer99 · Post by **lancer99** » Fri May 09, 2008 5:49 am

Darryl,

I wouldn't worry about it. IMO there is nothing wrong with posting links to (possibly) copyrighted material...it's up to each person's individual conscience as to whether they want to click on the link or not.

Peyote Pete wrote:I don't know if your into lithops or not, but they are auctioning some rare books on ebay.

Lithops - Treasure of the Veld
Lithops Flowering Stones

They are pretty pricey though.

Thanks for that. I have some Lithops but an not a huge fan!

But I am happy to have found a remaindered copy of "Illustrated Handbook of Succulent Plants: Dicotyledons" for $80!

-R